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First Grow, DWC NightOwl Heartbreaker

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2932
3 years ago
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10
Grow Conditions
Week 3
Vegetation
10.16
cm
inch
Height
24 hrs
Light Schedule
12+ conditions after
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Nutrients
ml/l
ml/gal
tsp/gal
4+ nutrients after
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MyWeedAccount MyWeedAccount
4 years ago
3/23 - start of week 3! (aka day 15 since sprout). The girls are looking happy, so I'm not changing anything just yet. They are still drinking an equal portion of nutes to water, and the pH has remained right where I want it. Increasing the light intensity has added a few more degrees to the tent, but well within the desired range. It has been difficult to maintain the desired VPD as this implies a consistently high RH %, and I'm worried that keeping my RH % higher than 75% will cause issues. Roots on both plants are super vigorous and healthy! They are loving the aeration of these bucket air stones! Potentially doing some LST later this week, depending on how quick the growth is Heather: 450 ppm 5.95 pH Helen: 385 ppm 5.89 pH 3/25 - Ok, we have our first deficiency/issue! I'm not 100% sure what happened, but I'm suspecting it was due to one of the following: potentially too much water in the buckets (not enough gap between the netpot and water) and not enough nutes. This is causing slight curling at the tips and droopiness in the leaves, although they still look a healthy green. I did a full res change today. I lowered the water level a bit, and upped the ppm on both, so hopefully, that will take care of both issues. I also got really neurotic about VPD and flipped the tent around so that the humidifier is in a different position to more evenly disperse the vapor. I'm currently re-calibrating both sensors as well since they were pretty different results for being 2 feet away. Since I changed the tent around (including the camera to not get in the way), the continuity of the timelapse will be...interesting haha *** res change day *** pre-res change> Heather: 416 ppm 6.25 pH 71.4 F water temp Helen; 354 ppm 6.31 pH 70.3 F water temp post res-change> Heather: 568 ppm 5.75 pH 58.1 Fwater temp (will rise quickly) Helen; 568 ppm 5.75 pH 57.2 F water temp 3/26 - Posted a question earlier b/c the girls were still not improving after the res change, and actually look a bit worse. Going to trust the advice of the veterans and chalk it up to growing pains. The roots on both girls still look white and healthy and there are even new roots popping out of the netpot still. Just seems like she isn't elongating more, but perhaps that's just the indica bushiness. I took a reading tonght and the ppm is noticeably higher on both at ~ 650 ppm, and the pH has crept up to 6. The temp is already back to 69/70 as expected, but the insulation helps keep it there. I'm replacing some res water with some pHed distilled water to try and lower ppm a bit. Crossing my fingers that I'm just going to wake up tomorrow to some better growth. Lights are at 75% intensity now, still the same distance away from when I started. *after replacing ~.5 gal in each res bucket with .5 gal of pHed distilled water * Heather: 531 ppm 5.94 pH 68.3 F water temp Helen: 588 ppm 5.88 pH 69.3 water temp 3/27 - Unfortunately, the deficiency still seems to be setting in, and I'm not sure what the issue is. All the symptoms seem like root rot, but I feel like I'm doing all the right things: res is at least 1-2" below bottom of netpot, strong air stone with 10W air pump, hydroguard, insulation around bucket to block light, water res at 70F....what am I missing here? I'm going to post a new grow question now that the symptoms are more pronounced, so there will be pics showing the splotching on the leaves. There are still healthy new white roots being developed so I'm really confused why the plant seems stunted, and leaves are drooping and curling. The ppms and pH are the same from the other night which is a good sign (I think). 3/28 - Alright, I think we're making some progress now - at least, they're not appearing worse. The challenge is, there were likely several issues, and a lot of these issues have similar symptoms, so we'll never know for sure. I think it was a combination of the air stone bubbles soaking the rapid rooter medium and causing the drowning-like symptoms, cal-mag issues (evident on the splotches on the lower leaves where they were rubbing against the pot), and "potentially" no sleep! I asked a couple of questions here and Reddit, and I'm going to try a 20/4 or 18/6 light cycle for now, which was suggested by several experienced growers. I think it's crazy that it's 2021 and we don't know for sure what is the optimal light cycle for autos, but I suppose the genetics of every plant are slightly different, and it's hard to be exact. Crossing my fingers that this allows them time to recover and start strecthing. While the leaves seem to be the right size, there is zero stretching (probably from the 'drowning'), and it's going to be an issue later if they're all blocking light. ppm and pH looks good from the other day though! I know some think the nutes are high, but the plants are telling me it's working based on the day-to-day differentials. Heather: 552 ppm 6.03 pH 71.2 Fwater temp (hoping Hydroguard helps so I don't need to decrease temp) Helen: 569 ppm 6.04 pH 70.5 F water temp 3/29 - What a day, where to start. The ladies are looking much, MUCH better. They are actually drinking a lot of nutes! I may need to increase even more next res change. I added 2mL of hydroguard to each res...just because. The root system in both are looking healthy, but the gap between the res and the netpot might be too large now (~5 inches). I'm considering running 2 air stones. Also, (see pics) I felt like the new growth from the top was sufficient to start LST, so I did. Helen took it a lot easier, as Heather's stalk is already starting to firm up, so I didn't want to push anything. I'll likely have to readjust this at some point, but it's a start. I actually didn't realize how many new growth sites were happening underneath all these bushy leaves. I'm sticking with the 20/4 light cycle for now. Heather: 494 ppm (someone was thirsty!) 6.01 pH 69.9 F water temp Helen: 518 ppm (also thirsty!) 5.99 pH 69.2 F water temp 3/30 - Ladies are looking great and spreading out thanks to some leaf tucking and LST on the main branch on both. I may need to do another one tomorrow. I am preparing for not only a res change but a bucket change tomorrow (see pics). I have *NO* idea how I missed this idea, but I am convinced this is the best way to do DWC sans a real water chiller, which just seems excessive unless I'm doing legit rDWC (which I'm not...yet). DWCooler is the way to go, and I don't know why more people aren't doing this vs. the generic 5 gallon bucket + insulation (like myself). Anyway, hopefully, this will help spread the word. The ppm and pH is still in check, so I'll be continuing with my nute schedule and going into the transition week feeding. Tomorrow will officially start week 4! Expect more pics once I get the ladies in their new homes. The cooler water will give more oxygen and Helen needs it. Who would have thought in week 1 that she would be the problem child? Clearly, I'm excited by this new transition to DWC greatness. Heather: 481 ppm 6.07 pH 71.2 F water temp Helen: 516 ppm 6.02 pH 70.7 F water temp Thanks for following ๐Ÿค™ Always, appreciative of tips or suggestions
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Grow Questions
MyWeedAccount
MyWeedAccountstarted grow question 4 years ago
They look overwatered, but this is DWC and I'm not top-feeding. Not sure what is going on as the leaves, themselves, look a healthy color. Pics from 3/25 show this, and I have detailed info in my diary. I have tried dropping humidity down (was keeping up for VPD). Thanks
Solved
Leaves. Curl down
1 like
Ganjagrandaddy
Ganjagrandaddyanswered grow question 4 years ago
dont panic at alol. those roots look great so thats a good sign. if the strain has an inica lean then the leave can be like cabbage leaves sometimes. they take a lot to hold up in the warm air too. all looks good from here buddy. roots will keep you posted. below will go 1st and the tops will be behind in time with resonding so keep those roots happy an the rest will be good. you have all the right stuff in there and hydroguard will keep the res happy too. good luck
MyWeedAccount
MyWeedAccountstarted grow question 4 years ago
Unfortunately, I can only write so much here, but I have a lot more details in my grow diary. The droopiness started about 3-4 days ago, but now has started showing deficiencies in the leaves, and plants seem stunted on height. Day 19 since sprout.
Solved
Leaves. Curl down
Leaves. Color - Mottling
Plant. Too short
like
Organoman
Organomananswered grow question 4 years ago
Two things come to mind... 1) nutrients too strong and 2) the biggie, 24 hour light! Your poor baby plants are simply exhausted. Nothing on Planet Earth has ever evolved to live in constant state of activity and without some sort of "sleep" every 24 hours. Changing to an optimum lighting schedule for all cannabis plants, autos or photoperiod plants in veg, of 18/6 will see them recover and return to full health once again. Your plants will grow faster, healthier and stronger at 18/6 than at 24/0 due to the fact they are getting the "sleep" they need for a healthy and balanced metabolism. 24 hour light can only be recommended by people who either don't care about their plants or do not understand the basics of how plants function and grow. Part of a plants functioning is "sleep", without it a plant will go haywire waiting endlessly for a rest that will never come. This is bordering on plant cruelty, but is never too late to change to a normal and healthy 18/6 light dark schedule. I like to think of the 6 hours of "sleep" as 2 hours to recover from the day, 2 hours to rest and 2 hours to get ready for the day ahead and this is basically what occurs during the dark cycle. Sleep deprivation is a common torture technique for good reason, it drives people nuts, no doubt your little plants feel the same! Besides, cannabis can only grow so much during any 24 hour hour period and this growth tops out at about 18 hours, meaning running your lights any longer than 18 hours is basically a waste of electricity. The 18/6 light dark schedule has been derived at through over 80 years of dedicated cannabis research and is not a random number, but a scientific fact. Treat your plants to the sleep they NEED and everything should go back on track with normal growth and a natural circadian rhythm. Lord knows every living thing needs one. The small blotches at the end of the leaves are damage caused by the leaves hitting the side of the pot repeatedly when the fans blow on them and is of little consequence. Also, make sure your nutrient solution is not getting too warm, this can cause your plants to droop as well. Hope this helps, and help your plants, they NEED "sleepy time"! Cheers,............ Organoman.
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StunFlower
StunFlowerweek 6
Your plants look lovely. Sorry to hear about your rez change issues - I know first-hand it can be a pain when you ScrOG with DWC. I'm currently using a battery powered transfer pump that works really well - I haven't had significant issues with it sucking up roots; it's a stick styled pump and as long as I get it situated so it's sitting at the bottom of the bucket all is good. All the best with the rest of your grow ๐Ÿ‘
MyWeedAccount
MyWeedAccount
@StunFlower, thanks! I'm hoping it works out as well as I think it will. My plan is to add camlocks (very similar to this person's setup https://www.instructables.com/How-to-Make-a-Mash-Tun-for-Brewing-All-grain-Beer/ ) to make detaching super easy. It's not the cheapest solution, but I don't mind paying more for quality and convenience. Just ordered the parts from the same place in that article, so hopefully should be able to get things set up in the next week or two. Stay tuned!
StunFlower
StunFlower
@MyWeedAccount, Your reservoir solution looks intriguing. I'll be watching that with interest. The vacation challenge is real - I'm still a slave to my buckets; I have to schedule getaways between runs ๐Ÿ˜‚
MyWeedAccount
MyWeedAccount
@StunFlower, thanks friend! It was probably a bit ambitious of me to try ScrOG with DWC for my first grow, but I was just too excited to try all the techniques haha The good news is that I think I've come up with a simple solution to both my res change and vacation challenge -- I bought two more 5-gallon coolers, and I'm going to set them up as a reservoir for each DWC bucket (still DWC, not recirculating...yet). Very similar to this guy's build: https://support.ilovegrowingmarijuana.com/t/single-bucket-dwc-mods/41783. Cheers!
Ferenc
Ferencweek 11
Happy Flowering @MyWeedAccount
Waylate
Waylateweek 7
Ace grow to you
y0shimitsu
y0shimitsuweek 7
Great job man ๐Ÿ™Œ๐Ÿป thanks for sharing ๐Ÿ™๐Ÿป enjoy ๐Ÿ’š๐ŸŒฑ
Waylate
Waylateweek 8
Looks awesome your doing a real good job
Waylate
Waylate
@MyWeedAccount, thank you and all the best to you
MyWeedAccount
MyWeedAccount
@@Waylate, thanks ๐Ÿ™ !! I saw you just started a new grow, all the best!
steadfast_grower
steadfast_growerweek 8
Nice job on the camlocks. A couple of quick thoughts: I use NPT to barbed connections on my RDWC drain lines. Maybe an NPT to barbed fitting would help. I'm sure the brewing industry may have something if type b to barbed fitting is available. Then you could just run your drain hose to a shower or sink drain. Another thought about sealing any leaks, check out Aquaseal which a flexible premium silicone product. You can grab a big tube of it off ebay for about 20 bucks and is commonly used for marine and fishing applications. PPM: It was hard to tell from the wording if they were eating 500pms a week or staying at 500pm. If PPMs stay the same and the water is dropping, I'd say they are eating and drinking at the same rate which is ideal. Mine are eating 100pms per day and I am now trying to increase nutrients until they level out and eat/drink at same rate. Regarding humidity: I'd take your dehumidifier from outside the tent and put it inside the tent if you have room. Then I'd suggest an Inkbird humidity controller and hook your humidifier and dehumidifier up to the controller and set the value you want. Keep your exhaust fan on a constant low setting. Another way is to bring up the temp during which squashes the humidity or bring in cooler dry air from outside the temp using an AC in the room your tent resides. The trick is to tune your room to work in balance with what you need in the tent. I have a few minutes available atm so I'll elaborate on humidity and what works for me. I just switched out my equipment for flowering a few days ago and here is what works for me as I have multiple tents in one room. My room is 40% RH and 68f because I have an AC running in the room which is also cooling my RDWC reservoir outside the tent. A couple of days ago, I added a dehumidifier to the tent and I added an active intake fan to the tent to bring that cool dry air into the tent from the room on a low constant setting. Lights on: The tent sits at 77F if I leave the exhaust fan on a low setting but can dial in higher temps if I run the exhaust fan intermittently. The heat is produced solely by the lights. The Inkbird controller mainly runs the humidifier during the day to hit my 60% RH I've set for preflower because I'm constantly pulling in my 40% RH from the room on low setting. As I get later into flower and want to drop the RH and temp more, I'll just adjust the Inkbird controller and turn my exhaust fan and intake up a bit more. Lights off (7am to 11am): When lights go out, the plants transpire heavily as the temp drops. Lights off temp would go down to 64f without any heat source which is too much of a temperature swing IMHO. The dehumidifier provides some minor heating and dehumidification during lights out to keep in line with the 50% RH I set on Inkbird controller and a constant low exhaust puts the tent at solid 71F temp with exhaust fan and intake fan on a low setting. If I didn't use an AC outside the tent, my intake air would probably exceed 60% creating an endless cycle of dehumidification. Happy growing!
steadfast_grower
steadfast_grower
@MyWeedAccount, Thanks! I've learned so much this first go at RDWC and I find it rewarding to share the information I've learned on this journey. 1. I'm happy to hear it worked out. 2. I pushed mine way too hard on the week for and dropped it back into the 500's on week 5. Gradually increased since but this week, I chased my PPM. Both water level drops and PPM drops were occurring at fast rates daily. I'd top off in the 750 range would be back down in the low 600's later in the day or the next morning. It seems I finally stabilized it yesterday by bumping it up about 150 to 830 with a blend of grow and flower nutrients. It depends on the nutrient brand, but yeah, you will typically want to be close to 900+ for mid flower. Are you seeing any deficiencies? I'd suggest trying to bump it up gradually throughout the week a couple of 150-200ppm and see how they respond. Now is the time to add any flower additives if desired. I'm keeping my nutrients simple for this first run so only a couple of flower additives 3. The humidifier will surely work out for you especially with the Inkbird controller. Just do what you can for now and watch any leaves you have tucked for wet spots. Have fun!
MyWeedAccount
MyWeedAccount
@steadfast_grower, I wish I could give you more than just "a like" on this thing. The amount of info and tips you've given me has been invaluable! To address your points: 1. I'm not patient lol and I bought some Gorilla glue silicone caulk and put it on the other night -- so far, so good! I will definitely look into the one you mentioned if this fails for any reason. I had actually bought the NPT to barbed connection just in case, but I was able to fit the silicone tubes with a tube extender tool (and I'm adding hose clamps). 2. I'll try to word the ppm phrasing better. The past week the ppm generally rose up by 30-50 ppm per day (sometimes more), so I would steadily decrease the ppm by diluting with more water. I was pushing them before near 800 ppm until I saw slight nute burn, but ever since then, they've only wanted less. I'm at the ~500 ppm mark now, and that seems to be where they want it. I'm just wondering if this is too low for being a month into flowering (not that there's much I should do about it if that's what the plants want)? Typically, I see people using at least 800-1100 ppm in flower 3. Unfortunately, the 70 pint dehumidifier won't fit in the tent, but I do have a smaller one in there. I just purchased a more compact 50 pint unit to put in the tent as well. I do have an inkbird humidity controller set up for the dehumidifier, but it's not even needed b/c I have to keep the dehumidifier continuously on anyway. The humidity outside the tent is slightly below 40%, and I have my exhaust fan on full to bring in the lower humidity and remove the high humidity (+ airflow). The new humidifier gets here next Wednesday, so hopefully that will help, and in the meantime, I'll probably just keep the tent open with the mosquito net. I have quite a bit of airflow in the tent, so I'm hoping that combats the high humidity for now. Thanks again for all the advice, as always!
StunFlower
StunFlowerweek 11
Congrats on the bountiful, frosty harvest ๐Ÿ‘Š
MyWeedAccount
MyWeedAccount
@StunFlower, Thanks!! Just chopped the second last night and it's looking even more bountiful than the first!
steadfast_grower
steadfast_growerweek 3
Couldn't post to your reply to my accidentally deleted message. So I'll add here: PH Meter: I still say calibrate weekly instead of monthly. It is your most important measuring equipment and I couldn't believe my 6.2 reading was actually a 6.6 value after two weeks of use. Light: I've turned up my light more aggressively. I have a singleT5 hanging over each plant for blue spectrum and my HLG 300 v2 RSpec is cranked to 50% as of yesterday (Day 10) at 30" with no signs of curling yet. My goal is to have it 100% by week 3. Then I can start dropping the light 1 inch at a time until they say its enough. My theory is more light, more nutrient uptake. Enzymes: Lots of products. I chose to use the Flying Skull Z9 (Canada) Z7 (USA). It is a two-part solution. Enzyme and bio-safe cleaner which doesn't affect beneficial bacteria but helps keep buckets clean. It will create bubbles for first 12-16 hours, but is minimal by next day as it reduces, salts and other grime. Air: I'm using square EZ store buckets. I have the stone connected to a pump that is dialed down sitting under net pot. The other two stones in my bucket are off to the side of the net pot. to keep oxygen in the root zone but not saturating the net pot. I can see your point, round buckets would be more difficult to add more air without saturating Rapid Rooter. My net pots are the 8" current culture ones which have a riser in the middle which helps keep the RR from becoming to wet. I'm considering going with neoprene collars next round. LST: I would start LST in a few days after they perk back up - nice and gentle, then bend a bit more in a day or two after the first tie down if needed. My Night Owls typically start throwing pistils around day 30-35 so I'd start soon before they stretch. Happy to hear your plants are recovering. Cheers!
MyWeedAccount
MyWeedAccount
@steadfast_grower, Once again, THANK YOU! Super helpful. One thing I'm about to switch up is replacing my insulated lowes buckets with a 5 gallon igloo cooler, which is slightly more narrow and taller to help raise the netpots a bit more. I can't believe I didn't think of this earlier. This will also help with maintaining low water temps, which will boost the level of oxygen in the water. Hoping this takes things to the next level....can't. stop. tinkering. haha Thanks again!
steadfast_grower
steadfast_growerweek 1
If the tap root is poking out, I suggest getting it in the net pot on one layer of pebbles now. You can even poke the root through one of the holes. Then control your air pump so the bubbles are just misting the net pot but not saturating the rapid rooter. I'm also into my first RDWC run with Night Owl. Check out my Milk & Qookies diary, I had the roots hitting the water 5 days sooner than the first try with just a few changes. Saw your Reddit post and following your grow. Good luck on your first DWC!
MyWeedAccount
MyWeedAccount
@steadfast_grower, thanks for the advice!! I wish I saw your grow earlier b/c I came to the same conclusion that the rapid rooters retained water too easily, and have switched to spraying (and will in the future). I think I actually jumped the gun on this one and put them in the net pot (1 inch" hydroton layer underneath) immediately. Not the worst thing, but it's harder to check on it, so next grow I'll definitely be keeping it in the rapid rooter longer. The water is just at the net pot and the bubbles are hitting the bottom of the rapid rooter right now. I plan to slowly lower the water and keep checking under the netpot to see if the roots pop out (damn, my patience and eagerness is being tested haha). I'll definitely be following your grow. Your style is very similar and I appreciate the detailed hour notes! Cheers!
Mr_ZAF_Budz
Mr_ZAF_Budzweek 12
Looks amazing! Well done ๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿป
DevilsBud
DevilsBudweek 11
Awesome frosty grow ๐Ÿ‘Œ๐Ÿ‘Œ
sdoyle
sdoyleweek 11
Awesome job!!!!!!!
y0shimitsu
y0shimitsuweek 9
Thanks for sharing this growmie ๐Ÿ™๐Ÿป๐Ÿ’š enjoy! ๐Ÿ™Œ๐Ÿป
Lacrima
Lacrimaweek 9
Nice buds ! Happy Growing ! ๐Ÿ˜Š๐Ÿ’ช
MarsHydroLED
MarsHydroLEDweek 6
Happy growing mate ๐Ÿ˜Š
steadfast_grower
steadfast_growerweek 3
Thanks for reply. Not sure, but my comment was accidentially removed. I'll re-post here for reference. ---------------------------------- I ran into similar problems on week 4 as well. Drooping, which then turned to yellowing and then root issues. I tried different PH ranges from 5.8-6.0 and 6.1-6.3 along with upping nutrients and other tactics. I saved them but ended up moving them to soil and starting over in RDWC because I figured, after two weeks of stunted growth the effort wasn't going to pay off with autos because the first few weeks are so important before they start to flower at about day 30. My plants were much smaller than I had anticipated for being 30 days in. No regrets, I learned a lot. I anticipated problems would likely happen. I also sterilized, and rebuilt my system with some design changes which will solve some of the issues that led to the plant deficiencies. I'm already into week two on my second try and everything is going much better this round. Some things I learned on my first try which may help you diagnose: 1. Keep water level exactly level. If it fluctuates, the air roots can drown and simulate overwatering, the wilting. 2. Calibrate PH monitor/pen. BlueLab suggests calibrating the Guardian monthly, when I checked I was 4 points off. Calibrating weekly with water changes now. 3. More Air. I became convinced the root zone needed more oxygen, even with a waterfall. I'm now running 3 stones in each bucket now across two pumps so I have redundancy in case one pump fails. Additionally, I dial down the air pump attached to the stone under the net pot to avoid over-saturating the rapid rooter, but leave the other stones in bucket full throttle. 4. Push the nutrients to find the limit, maybe 5ml at a time - I go for some slight tip burn on first set of leaves, I was totally underfeeding on my first try. 5. Boost LED light dimmer more aggressively. Full strength at 30" by week 3. More light results in more nutrient uptake. 6. Add an enzyme product to work WITH Hydroguard. Enzymes work with beneficials and break down any dead plant matter and loose roots floating around. 7. PPE: Sanitizing hands regularly and wearing latex gloves when messing with any water and net/pot contact. 8. I've added shields over the net pots to ensure I don't have any additional light leaks. My clay is chunky and the bag consists of about 10% round marble-sized balls. I used black bristol board with a square hole and slit. 9. Add hydroguard/beneficials/enzymes every TWO days. Beneficial bacteria only lasts about 48 hours and peak population is at 24hours from adding to system. When running a live system, You will always have bad bacteria in there, the trick is to keep adding an army of good bacteria to keep the bad bacteria outnumbered. If the temps go past 72F, I add an extra dose just as a protective measure. Adding too much won't hurt the plant's health. 10. Stop messing with them... which I'm doing more on my second try now that I can know and can visualize what's happening underneath the net pot. I had just moved this tent to a new room with new venting, so I had a lot of environmental conditions to dial in the first round. Adhering to VPD using leaf temp as best I can. I agree with @ORGANOMAN 20/4 or 18/6 light cycle is definitely necessary. The dark hour is when the plant works on the root system, underneath and undergoes other changes. Additionally, it allows the water solution to cool down. My night cycle, takes the solution back to 66f each morning. Dropping the ambient air temperature even a few degrees during night cycle is so important in regards to leaf temp and the changes they undergo internally as well. Hoping you solve the issue! I want you to succeed! Good luck!
Oozle
Oozleweek 1
Good luck on your 1st DWC run!